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Post by tsrwright on Oct 26, 2010 5:15:23 GMT 1
Herewith some photos of the Skirrow recently ex Canada now Australia. Mostly it is seemingly complete and original with some points to note: . Engine was mixture of 1950+ bottom end with prewar timing cover, heads, barrels etc so I did not buy this and will acquire another ex Skirrow or make one. . The 1950+ JAP crankcase was wider at the sprocket so note the rear clutch left of the seat has been spaced out and the chassis cut out a little to accomodate the new position. Strangely the front clutch does not seem to have been modified; I must think about this. Does this suggest the car was powered by this engine but maybe with drive to rear only? . The detachable bits of the steering wheel don't seem original; the wheel rim is too close to the scuttle so maybe the column has been shortened. The wheel is Bluemels (sp?) same is fitted to Super Sports Morgan 3Ws. . The seat squab is missing; the rest of the trim seems original with some broken fixing studs replaced by additional ones. . There is no dog clutch nor is there any form of gearbox with or without gears. There is simply 2 x countershaft with clutch rods operating down the centre. There is a lever with cable on the left side of the scuttle which operates a slide which secures the clutch pedal in the depressed position. . The filler cap is magnificent but probably not original - does it help identify the car? . This is not the car shown in published prewar photos of Les White - that car is the lower 1936/7 style. This car is 1938/9. Can we talk of Mk1 and Mk2? Is any more known of this car being in his showroom before being sold to the US? Plenty more to say but that should do for now. Happy to post more photos - just ask Attachments:
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Post by haflinger121 on Oct 26, 2010 16:23:08 GMT 1
Bluemels were a company who made all sorts of car parts back in the day, frequently add-on wing mirrors for road cars. Your spelling is correct. Great photos and thanks for the update.
Just a thought, but had you considered comparing notes with Ivan Dutton regarding the build/mechanicals of a Skirrow - just tell me to shut up if I'm "teaching granny how to suck eggs"!
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Post by tsrwright on Oct 27, 2010 10:32:50 GMT 1
Just a thought, but had you considered comparing notes with Ivan Dutton regarding the build/mechanicals of a Skirrow
Thanks for the info. I did email Ivan via his business but didn't get a response. Anyone have a private address?
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Post by haflinger121 on Oct 28, 2010 19:44:18 GMT 1
I will send you a contact via PM Terry (it is Terry isn't it?) as I don't know if Ivan wants his details broadcast on here.
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Post by allensawyer23 on Dec 15, 2010 4:47:56 GMT 1
blumels are now known for their advanced bicycle parts
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Post by tsrwright on Dec 27, 2012 10:21:36 GMT 1
Bit of an update:
The chassis was completely stripped and bead basted. The rear axle was twisted and turned out simply to be case hardened mild steel so a new one was made with some slight modifications. Bearings have been replaced of course and new flexible drives fitted ex BSA Front Wheel Drive Club. The BSA steering box has been serviced. I have new sprockets front and rear. The BSA universal joints are a little worn but are not available and the existing ones should be serviceable.
The whole chassis has been painted and assembled and will be on its wheels when I sort out tyres. I look like getting 12" trailer tyres and hand cutting further grooves to make knobs. There doesn't seem to be anything suitable otherwise; there are period type 12" Firestones available but they are too big for the Skirrow not to mention the price.
The chassis parts have been painted a Machinery grey; there was no evidence on the chassis or the body of what the original paint may have been. I do know the body was completely redone (with lots of filler) by Malcolm White when he and father Les had it late 'sixties, I think it was, before it was sold to America.
I have acquired a post-war 8/80 JAP ex South Africa which is similar to the prewar engine except it has magnesium alloy cases (I think the prewar case were aluminium) with a sump and uses a gear type pump rather than the original double Pilgrim. For simplicity I'll probably just use the gear pump and the timing cover that comes with the engine although I have obtained one of the pre-war pumps with the right rotation. The engine will need a straightforward total rebuild. It came with alloy barrels as was normally the case in Coopers so I had to find the right pattern and length of 4 stud iron barrels which are not the same as the 4 stud single.
I managed to get several of these from the UK where I also picked up several Rudge dirt track clutches which are as rare as the proverbial ... The clutches on the Skirrow were much knackered Nortons so in due course I should have this side of things sorted more or less as original.
The body is all there and just needs minor attention and repainting. I know from experience there is still quite a way to go but the worst of it is over.
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Post by haflinger121 on Dec 27, 2012 14:44:45 GMT 1
Thanks for the update Terry, it all sounds as though she's going in the right direction. Especially good to hear you have resolved the problem regarding the lack of a motor. I thought you might have more of a problem with that. When I asked Ivan what he was going to do about an engine for the ex-Rhiando car, he airily replied, 'Oh, we should be able to pick one of those up for only about ten grand'. Only! But, as far as I know, he's still looking...
Do you know what colours you are going to paint it in finally? Will it still be red and white and no.7?
Incidentally, where are you finding the time to worry about cataloguing old-time UK race meetings, results, etc?!
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Post by tsrwright on Dec 28, 2012 11:59:49 GMT 1
Herewith some photos I have found at last. I'll probably stick to the red and cream but not the number which I think was a recent invention. If I donlt find anything different I'll use Les Whites old number maybe even though it was never on this car. I know the car came from Dave Hughes so I keep looking at old photos for the distinctive filler cap (maybe a later addition) and the left-hand magneto lever - usually they were on the right for some reason - with a view to identifying it. Attachments:
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Post by tsrwright on Dec 28, 2012 12:02:25 GMT 1
Another Skirrow pic Attachments:
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Post by tsrwright on Dec 28, 2012 12:03:19 GMT 1
Last Skirrow pic Attachments:
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Post by tobyhalter on Dec 28, 2012 12:08:48 GMT 1
You probably know this link already but there's some stuff and photos about Skirrows on it with some references to the legendary Dave Hughes as well. www.bsafwdc.co.uk/page21.php
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Post by tsrwright on Dec 29, 2012 1:57:12 GMT 1
Incidentally, where are you finding the time to worry about cataloguing old-time UK race meetings, results, etc?! Answer is I am not which is why I may be a bit slow contributing the work on a meeting database I have undertaken to try and set up.
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Post by haflinger121 on Dec 29, 2012 13:06:40 GMT 1
Thanks again for the photos and info - all looking good. Just a fleeting thought about the left side mounted mag lever; you don't suppose this might have been easier for somebody who only had a hook (as opposed to a hand) on that side do you? Maybe that person had more important things for the right hand to do when it came to driving the car? As I say, just a fleeting thought - I'm probably barking up the wrong tree entirely.
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Post by memaerobilia on Dec 29, 2012 19:27:58 GMT 1
Terry; I applaud all the work you have done to the Skirrow. At this point I am getting a bit excited to anticipate some future videos of it running, and hearing the sound etc. As my late father (who built midget and other racing cars for nearly 50 years, and restored several dozen vintage, and pre-war racing cars) and I, owned the car for some 35 years, I have fond memories of it. We obtained it from The Massachusetts Museum of Transportation, in the early 1970s We were under the impression that it had been stored there, for years, collecting dust, and unrestored. (It was obtained from them in a unusual grouping of the SKirrow, a 1913 Indian Twin cylinder motorcycle, and an odd PUCH motorcycle, all seemingly complete, and with years of storage dust.) All the items and features of the Skirrow were left untouched, to try to preserve as much original history as possible. *In those pre-Internet years, there was VERY LITTLE Skirrow information to be found or had, except for a few photocopy pages of articles from the Museum's file on it. Had it been our ONLY vintage racer, we likely would have (tried to) fully restore it and run it. But we had many others that were shiny new restorations, in those years. We usually had an average of 10-12 pre-war racers in our "shop collection, taking up a lot of room. We often sold one, or two as the NEXT restoration rolled off the project areas, to replace it/them. We added/changed NOTHING to it. Any of the changes from original had been done long before we obtained it. Some might think it odd, that we often took it to large vintage auto shows, along with one of our restored midgets or Sprint cars. It was wondrfully amusing to see an entire group, leave the viewing of a nearby half million dollar Ferrari, to rush over to see this odd 4-wheel drive, chain drive British racing car ;D Then we had the added enjoyment, since the car was unrestored, to allow young children to have their photo taken (sitting in a race car that was THEIR size!) with ear to ear smiles ;D You mention a missing seat "squab." I can only assume that means the bottom seat cushion? I was VERY upset to have had the car delivered, on a tractor trailer that moved 4 of our cars from NY , down to Alabama, when I moved there, to become an aircraft museum director, in 1994. The Bottom seat had been left in the car, on the open trailer, and had apparently been blown out, on the highway. I well remember it as being a very plain black leather seat cushion/pad, only about an inch thick and filled wth excelsior, I believe, but MAY possilby have been horsehair. I have NO CRITICISM of your choice in restoring the car. We faced MANY similar decisions to be made, in the decades of building and restoring these cars. As the new owner, it is ONLY YOUR preference which must be satisfied, and funded, and paid for, and Many hours of work dedicated etc etc. I would differ with you on the choice to forego the purrchase of the car, with the engine that WAS in it, all those years. You and Barry have well established that it could not have been the first, original engine, as first built, but it certainly Must have been a part of the cars history as the one it LIKELY ran its last races with. I might have considered removing that engine, had I access to the absolutely original state of the first engine it ran with,.But you are still going to use a post war engine now, yet just a different one. The engine that was with the car for some 50? years, seemed preferable to me. But, just as WE never realized it was Not the Original engine, it won't be of concern or notice to the vast majority of those who will thoroughly ENJOY and appreciate your restoration. Well done
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Post by haflinger121 on Dec 29, 2012 23:51:21 GMT 1
Hi Joe. I have to say that I too would have stuck with the motor that was in it, purely on the grounds that it was probably raced with that in there in the 1950's, added to my inate laziness, plus the difficulty of obtaining another one! But as you say, it is Terry the car needs to satisfy and no-one else. And from what I can see, he's doing a superb restoration job in all ways; I can't wait to see it finished.
Just as a matter of interest, what did eventually happen to the motor which was in it previously?
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